Posts by Jonathan Drake

7

The new doomsday mag

by Jonathan Drake in

so i just took a look at this and here is the dilemma:.

where does the bible say that the world will be so literally destroyed like that?.

1. i believe one may think of the verse in zechariah or zephaniah about the dead to your right and left- however was regarding jerusalem.. 2. peter speaks of a new heavens and earth where the elements being intensely hot will melt.

Jonathan Drake

pronomono6 hours ago
I glanced over the pictures. My first thought? Jehovah will destroy those ruining the earth. Looks like he ruined the earth pretty good in those pictures.

This is is such a good point. I will use this as well.

31

the Witch of Endor

by Magnum in

1sa 28:3-25 (nwt - not revised version).

7 finally saul said to his servants: seek for me a woman who is a mistress of spirit mediumship, and i will go to her and consult her.

then his servants said to him: look!

Jonathan Drake

I should point out, for clarity, that while the context of what happens with Saul and the medium suggests a very likely probability the real issue at hand of a soul that is separate from the body shouldn't be dismissed.

the fact is, as you pointed out, the bible isn't actuslly clear because translation into English leaves some things in doubt. Like in psalms it says that a persons spirit goes out before they go back to the ground (still haven't researched that yet), it also seems to indicate a separation in other areas which I can't think of off the top of my head. Then in the book of Enoch it specifically says that the souls of the dead go off into different... Sort of receptacles after death where they wait.

its a very interesting subject. But at least where Samuel is concerned, my response is likely the one you'll get from anyone still in- and unfortunately the context supports it. So a different angle, in my opinion, would be best- if intended to use on such people. And outside sources like those posited here will be ignored by those people. Thus, as you mentioned, studying the same bible they use for support (real and not created support) of possibilities to put forward is the best course imo.

also, it wasn't my intention to give offense, I just took what you said at face value. Something cannot supposedly be a thing in a case such as this- either it is or it is not. Your choice of verbiage suggests you either think it isn't or have serious enough doubts to use words that suggest it isn't (I.e., supposedly is a word that inherently casts doubt). And I'm not bothered either way whether you feel it is or isn't.

31

the Witch of Endor

by Magnum in

1sa 28:3-25 (nwt - not revised version).

7 finally saul said to his servants: seek for me a woman who is a mistress of spirit mediumship, and i will go to her and consult her.

then his servants said to him: look!

Jonathan Drake

First, we're talking about the supposed Word of the Almighty God...

This is the problem right here. Just as because Saul wanted it to be Samuel and so he believed it was Samuel and so it was- so you don't want the bible to be the word of God and nothing anyone says will convince you that it is. There's no difference, and therefore no point.

7

The new doomsday mag

by Jonathan Drake in

so i just took a look at this and here is the dilemma:.

where does the bible say that the world will be so literally destroyed like that?.

1. i believe one may think of the verse in zechariah or zephaniah about the dead to your right and left- however was regarding jerusalem.. 2. peter speaks of a new heavens and earth where the elements being intensely hot will melt.

Jonathan Drake

I hate doing this, but I'll link it.. Ugh lol

http://www.jw.org/en/publications/magazines/wp20150501/

80

Ayn Rand - Opinions?

by cappytan in

jw
friends

for those of you familiar with ayn rand and her ideas on morality, rationality and reason, what is your opinion of those ideas?.

i'm talking about her actual ideas, not the ideals that libertarianism has adopted and, in some cases, perverted.

do you think she's a charlatan?

Jonathan Drake

... In a way, you could say Ayn Rand also positively influenced me as well, but in the sense of "don't be a jerk like her".

LOL. omg I hope I'm reading this right. this is my hearty belly laugh for the day, and I still can't stop.

31

the Witch of Endor

by Magnum in

1sa 28:3-25 (nwt - not revised version).

7 finally saul said to his servants: seek for me a woman who is a mistress of spirit mediumship, and i will go to her and consult her.

then his servants said to him: look!

Jonathan Drake

I have a question:

When you go to a spiritualist today or a medium to speak with the dead, do you see the spirit or speak with it, or does the medium act as an intercession between you and the supposed spirit which you never actually see or coherently hear?

But that also tells us something else. David did not know that this was the battle that Saul would be “swept away” in. (1Sa 26:10) Jehovah did not reveal that to him. But several days later, after David had been sent home, the spirit entity that spoke to Saul spoke as if he knew for sure that Saul would die in this battle. If it was a demon, then how could he speak with such certainty? How did he know for sure what David did not know at all. And how could he know for sure that the battle would end disastrously in just one day? (1Sa 28:19 – “tomorrow”)

also as to the above statement, this is an assumption to suggest the demons could not have known. In the book of Job satan is recorded as walking right in among the Angels in heaven during a gathering- so clearly in the Old Testament the devil and the demons had freedom to come and go as they please- there is no reason they could not have known the battle would be Sauls last.

further, Saul had had the spirit mediums run out and killed. So this woman, who pretended to see and speak with and for Samuel could have been getting revenge on Saul, who was known to have been being terrorized by a spirit (1 Sam 16:14).

This was therefore 1 of 2 things:

1. It was the evil spirit terrorizing him, which was actually from God.

2. It was the spirit medium getting revenge for her fallen and murdered brethren.

as to the comment that the bible should just say that- I've never had any problem understanding this was likely not Samuel. And when you read the entire context of the book it does speak for itself, as it says a spirit was terrorizing him- therefore this was likely that spirit. Pretty easy conclusion to reach IMO. Also, if a person said they went to a psychic and spoke with their dead mother- you would know that they meant a ceyonce was held and the medium spoke in a creepy voice or otherwise for this supposed spirit- the person would not need to include those details. Point being, at the time of the writing of this, the process and events were inherent in the culture and those details were unnecessary. But I would argue they still aren't, because spirit mediums havent changed much...

7

The new doomsday mag

by Jonathan Drake in

so i just took a look at this and here is the dilemma:.

where does the bible say that the world will be so literally destroyed like that?.

1. i believe one may think of the verse in zechariah or zephaniah about the dead to your right and left- however was regarding jerusalem.. 2. peter speaks of a new heavens and earth where the elements being intensely hot will melt.

Jonathan Drake

So I just took a look at this and here is the dilemma:

where does the bible say that the world will be so literally destroyed like that?

1. I believe one may think of the verse in Zechariah or Zephaniah about the dead to your right and left- however was regarding Jerusalem.

2. Peter speaks of a new heavens and earth where the elements being intensely hot will melt. But when you look up the Greek words in use you see he was very likely meaning the elements of what this world is build on (so greed, corruption, money, power- whatever you can think of that allows the world to go on being rough, also these are plausible examples- I'm not saying this IS what he meant specifically, only that it isn't a literal tangible thing that is melting).

3. In revelation when the dragon is finally thrown into the fire there is a distinct missing party. The false prophet is there, the harlot is there, the dragon is now there and death soon follows.... But no beast? The beast which represents the nations of earth is not thrown into the fire....

- -

this is what popped into my mind. I'm curious of anyone else has wondered the same thing or noticed how the bible, when talking about this war at the end, doesn't actually seem to say anything about the physical world being obliterated- it's just a spirit creature war in which the elements of evil are destroyed followed by a judging of the people.

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